Carbbackloading - CBL Melde Dich an, um diesen Inhalt zu abonnieren 2 2

[Alc 1164]

WTF 5000kcal?

Trinke über den Tag 4-5l

Esse in der ULC Phase ca. 1000kcal

und wenn ich am Abend auf 2500-3000kcal komme, bin ich echt happy!

5000kcal - ich würde meine Kloschüssel unenendlich liebhaben. Selbst in einem 4-6h Fenster schaffe ich es nicht!

Easy peasy :D hatte ich lange Zeit jeden Backload innerhalb 2h inklusive shake etc.

Eis + Cornflakes

Mohnstrudel + Nutella

November 8, 2012 bearbeitet von TheAce

[GarchingS54 329]

Ich sehe schon, ich muss dreckiger essen ;)

[TrollHead 2438]

Da wir hier offensichtlich ein paar Bulking-Experten haben, mal ne Frage:

Was hat viel KCal und genug Eiweiß, ohne Milch und Zucker? Am besten wären noch ein guter Preis und wenig pflanzliche Fette, aber das ist Tagträumerei

Wenns hart auf hart kommt, kann auch Zucker rein, ist ja eher für nachm Training.

[Nathol 1284]

FETTES FLEISCH!

[TrollHead 2438]

Okay, cool. Ist im Moment sowieso ein großer Posten bei mir. Wenn ich jetzt sogar mal den Off-Day durchgehe:

50g Bacon

2 Schnitzel (keine g, war Kantinenessen)

200g Bockwurst

100g Schinkenwürfel

100g Hähnchen

100g Schwein

[Gast Yeezyzz]

Dem Veggies

[Joy 248]

langsam wirde es immer leichter. Habe nun eine Methode gefunden, die ich immer parat habe, auch wenn ichs mal nicht schaffe einzukaufen oder zu kochen. Gerade im Angebot Jeder 30 cm Sub 5 Euro. Davon nehme ich 2 und 5 Cookies

null Probleme runter zu bekommen. Mit PWO Shake bin ich aber schon bei 3000 Kalorien im Ein Stunden Fenster. Danach noch ein Maltoshake mit bisschen eiweiß nochmal 600 Kalorien bin ich bei 4600 am Tag. Die 5000 müssten also drin sein. Ace kann das in der Tat sehr gut. Ideal ist halt wohl immer noch Reis+ Fleisch und 2. Mahlzeit cornflakes + Milch

[Joy 248]

Habe nach meinem Cut wirklich kein bisschen Fett zugenommen. Sehe das an der kleinen Ader die zart über meinen Bauch wandert. Die habe ich gegen ende des Cuts bekommen und diese bleibt bisher bestehen :)

[Alc 1164]

Habe nach meinem Cut wirklich kein bisschen Fett zugenommen. Sehe das an der kleinen Ader die zart über meinen Bauch wandert. Die habe ich gegen ende des Cuts bekommen und diese bleibt bisher bestehen :)

hat damit nichts zu tun Joy...

Es liegt zum einen an der Fettverteilung

Bei mir sammelt sich das meiste Fett an den Glutes und am lower back an.

Vaskulär wie verrückt war ich sehr lange am Bauch

und der nächste Faktor ist... schau dir einfach mal deine Unterarme / Arme an (falls ripped genug) während du backloadest,

es gibt einen Punkt im Backload wo diese extrem stark hervortreten.

Vermutung Carbs(oder sonst was was im Backload eine Rolle spielt) erhöhen für den Moment in dem sie konsumiert werden und für ein paar stunden danach die Vaskularität enorm

und 5000 kcal in kurzer Zeit sind auch nicht normal... bin halt etwas strange beim Essen.

Habe allerdings mal probiert was so geht am stück bis mir schlecht wurde...

das waren nur sauber gegessen:

2 große Bananen

30g Whey

10g Kreatin

20 min später

750g ungekochter Reis

250g Huhn

150g Asiagemüse

maßig an Soßen~200g+ (auch 200kcal auf 100g)

das macht kein Spaß

habe glaub 70 min gebraucht, aber sowas jeden Tag zu machen ist für mich unmöglich

für meinen Cut habe ich sowieso schon einige verdammt geile Ideen, gibt viele Perlen im internet

die Coconut Coffee Whey diet :D

November 9, 2012 bearbeitet von TheAce

[Shao 6453]

http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/pictures_pics_photo_body_image_performance/all_powerlifters_are_fatties

Hier sieht man gut den Unterschied zwischen Carb Depleted und Carb loaded. Dave wird vom Monster zu Godzilla durch das Carb Loading.

[Joy 248]

Habe nach meinem Cut wirklich kein bisschen Fett zugenommen. Sehe das an der kleinen Ader die zart über meinen Bauch wandert. Die habe ich gegen ende des Cuts bekommen und diese bleibt bisher bestehen :)

hat damit nichts zu tun Joy...

Es liegt zum einen an der Fettverteilung

Bei mir sammelt sich das meiste Fett an den Glutes und am lower back an.

Vaskulär wie verrückt war ich sehr lange am Bauch

und der nächste Faktor ist... schau dir einfach mal deine Unterarme / Arme an (falls ripped genug) während du backloadest,

es gibt einen Punkt im Backload wo diese extrem stark hervortreten.

Vermutung Carbs(oder sonst was was im Backload eine Rolle spielt) erhöhen für den Moment in dem sie konsumiert werden und für ein paar stunden danach die Vaskularität enorm

und 5000 kcal in kurzer Zeit sind auch nicht normal... bin halt etwas strange beim Essen.

Habe allerdings mal probiert was so geht am stück bis mir schlecht wurde...

das waren nur sauber gegessen:

2 große Bananen

30g Whey

10g Kreatin

20 min später

750g ungekochter Reis

250g Huhn

150g Asiagemüse

maßig an Soßen~200g+ (auch 200kcal auf 100g)

das macht kein Spaß

habe glaub 70 min gebraucht, aber sowas jeden Tag zu machen ist für mich unmöglich

für meinen Cut habe ich sowieso schon einige verdammt geile Ideen, gibt viele Perlen im internet

die Coconut Coffee Whey diet :D

Mein Lieblingszitat ist eh immer . If it would be easy, everyone would do it. It's great because it's hard ;). Das gilt in diesem Fall auch für die Ernährung. Wenn ich so esse wies mir Spaß macht, werde ich ewig dünn bleiben ;)..

Hab Massiv Respekt vor deinen Portionen und bin immer froh, wenn ich denen näher komme. Ich bin auch noch fast 20 kg schwerer als du.

Klar man kanns nicht genau sehen. Geb ich dir Recht. Aber findest du nicht, wenn du dich fast jeden Tag im Spiegel ansiehst, kannst du ungefähr einen Anhaltspunkt finden. Seitliche Abs, Adern, diese ganz kleinen seitlichen Abs über den ersten seitlichen Abs. Sixpack etc pp. Meine Waage geht nicht unter 9,5 obwohl ich weiter abgenommen habe, hat sie mir immer das Gleiche angezeigt haha. Caliper habe ich auch, aber komme nicht so recht damit klar. Da kann ich in der Tabelle ja nur auf 2% genau sehen wie viel KFA ich hab...

Ist im Prinzip eh nicht so wichtig. Hauptsache ich bulk wenn ich bulk und cut wenn ich cut.

Die Aussage war vor allen Dingen darauf bezogen, dass ich seitdem ich im 2h Fenster bleibe deutlich definierter bleibe als ohne. Irgendwie werd ich auch viel stärker. Es ist imo eh sinnvoller lieber 1-2h konzentriert zu essen, als 4h nebenbei, wo man fernsieht oder zockt. Weil dann isst man eh zu wenig.

105/135/145

Deadlift hab ich noch bisschen Luft nach oben aber laggt auch am meisten.

[Alc 1164]

Danke

Ich werde gerade fetter... aber ich mache auch kein CBL und trainiere nicht,

vielleicht am 16.11 wieder *praying*

bei mir verwest gerade eine ganze Bananenstaude und mehrere Packungen Poptarts laufen ab da kein train :(

@Shao

ja und man sieht auch die Vaskularität deutlicher... der Carbload ist heftig.

November 9, 2012 bearbeitet von TheAce

[Joy 248]

digga wünsch dir alles gute! Schaffst du schon. Denk dran. Jedem passiert mal sowas die die aus sowas gestärkt hervor gehen

werden außergewöhnlich ;)

[morumbinas 147]

weil ich es bei andro gelesen habe...

wer hat hier noch probleme mit einer verstopften nase + halsweh am nächsten tag nach nem ordentlichen backload aufgrund verschiebung des wasserverhältnis (schleimhäute trocknen aus?)?

muss wohl im backload wesentlich mehr trinken und dafür ne formverschlechterung hinnehmen. das ist echt nicht schön, fühle mich nach jedem backload richtig krank am nächsten tag in der früh...

[Joy 248]

Ich habe keine Probleme. Mir hat lediglich mal während dem Backload angefangen die Nase zu laufen. Und einmal sind mir die Sushi Rollen wieder aus der Nase gekommen :)

[Gast]

kenn das, hab sogar manchmal kopfschmerzen. obwohl ich ~5 l trinke

[CookinRev 35]

Keine Probleme, mir wird beim Backload lediglich warm ums Herz. :) 5-8 Liter vorm Training sollten imo auch reichen. im Backload kommen noch 1 Liter Milch dazu, 1 Pfund Reis und andere Köstlichkeiten. Bin immer happy.

November 14, 2012 bearbeitet von iPole

[morumbinas 147]

Keine Probleme, mir wird beim Backload lediglich warm ums Herz. :) 5-8 Liter vorm Training sollten imo auch reichen. im Backload kommen noch 1 Liter Milch dazu, 1 Pfund Reis und andere Köstlichkeiten. Bin immer happy.

geht nicht primär um das wasser das du vor deinem backload zu dir genommen hast, sondern dass die zugenommen carbs Wasser ua aus dem unterhautgewebe oder schleimhäute ziehen (deshalb laden ua bodybuilder mit carbs für nen trockeneren look).

[Alc 1164]

Wie bekommt Ihr das Kokusnussöl flüssig? Muss ich das echt mit warmen Wasser trinken.

@Ace der Shake am morgen ist 10 0 10 oder? mit Kokusnusöl und Whey/ISO?

Ich hab einfach Kokosfett genommen...

das hier:

http://www.amazon.de/Manako-Kokos%C3%B6l-Kokosfett-kaltgepresst-GLAS/dp/B0046FUMYE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1353489017&sr=8-1

mit dem Messer rauskratzen -> 10g in Kaffee rein, löst sich von selbst auf (Kaffee ist wegen seiner Insulinsensibilierungseigenschaften sehr wichtig hier) und dann 10g Wheyisolat rein und gut.

Mein Plan für den Cut war eh ganz speziell...

Aus einigen beiträgen von Kiefer, Philipp Rauscher und auf dangerouslyhardcore.com ist zu finden das kleine gaben von Kalorien sehr förderlich für die Fettverbrennung sind...

Eventuell kennt ihr das Gefühl das ihr kurzzeitig in der Fastenphase (bei niedrigem KFA) dieser downphasen habt, diese werden mit kleinen Gaben von Kalorien umgangen...

Philipp Rauscher tendiert in seinem IF Buch zu ~200kcal, gerade ausreichend um die Lipolyse aufrecht zu erhalten.

Kiefer sagt ab 14 Stunden fasten reguliert sich MTOR langsam runter und das wäre nicht optimal für den Muskelaufbau.

Bevor ich das Prinzip jemandem raten würde wollte ich es selbst testen.

Beispiel für meinen Zeitplan

~21 Uhr Backload Ende

nächster Tag fasten

- 1 Kaffee 1 grüner Tee

ab ~11 Uhr

10g Kokosfett, 10g Whey Isolat Kaffee

13 Uhr

10g Kokosfett, 10g Whey Isolat Kaffee

15 Uhr

erste Mahlzeit

größte Mahlzeit: Hackfleisch 400-500g + Gemüse

20Uhr

letzte Mahlzeit

diese muss nicht mehr 1:1 Fett haben wie Kiefer es sagt, sondern aufgrund der besseren Insulinsensibilität ist hier auch etwas mageres Fleisch erlaubt, also muss man nicht zwanghaft Butter essen um auf das Verhältnis zu kommen.

Bsp: Lachs/Bacon mit Gemüse, evtl Eier

oder Rindersteak mit Gemüse Butter und Fischöl

Nächster Tag

Training:

10 Uhr

10g Kokosfett, 10g Whey Isolat Kaffee

12:30 Uhr (bei mir so)

erste Mahlzeit, ungefähr 1:1 Fett Protein

Bsp: Lachs/Bacon mit Gemüse

wenig Kalorien

Preworkout

10g Kokosfett, 10g Whey Isolat Kaffee + 450mg Guarana Koffein Taurin

Training

Postworkout

30g Whey Kreatin 2 sehr reife bananen püriert (Kalium / VItamine und natürlich >> Traubenzucker)

duschen/kochen

backloaden (Backload innerhalb 2 Stunden nach Shake beenden)

um satt zu werden im Cut empfiehlt sich Reis mit viel Wasser, ganz ganz wenig Gemüse und Huhn, oder Kartoffeln (für größere Mengen)

---

Aus eigener Erfahrung reicht mir der 10gKokoswheykaffee shake genau 2 Stunden bis ich wieder Hunger habe.

und das größte Problem bei wenig KFA war irgendwann der Hunger zwischen Mahlzeit 1 und 2, durch die Shakes verringere ich die Zeit zwischen den Mahlzeiten und Hunger nicht so extrem.

zudem kaum pflanzliches Fett (bis auf Kokos)

so würde ich cutten imho, cardio wäre immer nur LISS und spazieren

[Joy 248]

http://www.youtube.c...d&v=yaj5ICd9Nt8

Das muss mir jetzt jmd erklären. Nicht das es bei meinen 6-7 Tagen Training einen großen Unterschied machen würde, aber waitw0t. Mir ist schon klar, dass geladene Speicher wichtig sind für ein gutes Training. Auch das mit dem Insulinspike verstehe ich. Aber seht euch mal die Kommentare. Das Programm heißt ja auch Backloading und nicht Preloading. Für mich war der größte Vorteil an CBL immer, dass ich eben deutlich mehr kcal konsumieren könnte als bei den meisten anderen Diäten. Jetzt soll ich auf einmal an nem OFF DAY richtig reinhauen ?!

Dezember 17, 2012 bearbeitet von Joy

[Alc 1164]

was neues:

Fett / Protein Ratio wurde nun offiziell von Kiefer rausgegeben. für jedes 1g an Protein sollte man ein Minimum von 0,5g an Fett konsumieren.

Für Leute die derzeit cutten oder unter 10% cutten wollen mit CNS / CBL gibt es ein File:

Carb Backloading - Carb Nite Strategies for Dropping Below 10% Body Fat

IAW CBL FLOW CHART

DIETARY CHANGES

1. Ensure you are under 30g of Useable carbs (CHO) during ULC periods.
   
2. Avoid vegetable fats (ie. Olives, olive oil, etc.) switch to animal fats, coconut oil, MCT oil
   
3. Decrease dietary fat during backloads earlier in evening (ie. Rice and chicken breast for dinner) Kiefer commented on this one, saying that you should focus on reloading your CHOs for a backload and not worry about adding extra fats. However, he also mentioned that if you are looking flat in the morning, but ‘jacked’ you may need to add some triglycerides in the back load period to restore muscle triglyceride levels. ‘Jacked I’m venturing a guess here will be appearing lean, but not hard or filled out.
   

http://www.dangerouslyhardcore.com/1733/hi-tech-nutrient-conversion-lessons-for-carb-back-loading/

Lessons for Carb Back-Loading by Kiefer

15

…

“OCFAs, on the other hand, we know convert easily into glucose. This is seen readily in animal and human studies where diets rich in even-chains lower blood glucose levels and allow a ketogenic metabolism to take over. An ultra-low carb diet that contains rich amounts of odd-chain fatty acids, however, allows the body to maintain blood glucose levels at the previous amount[28-31]. In other words, an ultra-low carb diet rich in OCFAs, is not ketogenic[31-33]; it’s not much different than a carb-based diet, metabolically that is.

“Since animal fats do contain a certain amount of OCFAs (not usually more than 5% total[34]), it’s actually a good reason to eat animal sources for the ability of the OCFAs to supply the small amount of glucose needed for the brain while preserving protein retention.”

“If the goal is absolute maximum fat loss, the back loads should be staged with the least amount of fat in the earlier meals and should be “fat back-loaded” during the refeed.

Another way of saying this is that the lower-fat your meals are in the first part of the evening, the junkier they can be in the two hours before bed.”

1. Sugar alcohols avoid them (ie. Gum, SF syrups, diet drinks)¹
   

The body does not recognize SPLENDA

®

Brand Sweetener as a sugar. In fact, clinical studies have shown that SPLENDA

®

Brand Sweetener (sucralose) does not affect blood glucose levels, insulin, or HbA1c. In a meal plan for people with diabetes, up to 4 packets of SPLENDA

®

No Calorie Sweetener or up to 8 teaspoons of SPLENDA

®

No Calorie Sweetener, Granulated, are considered a "free food." The American Dietetic Association and the American Diabetes Association consider a free food to be any food or beverage that contains less than 20 calories and 5 grams or less of carbohydrate per serving.

Like other no-calorie sweeteners formulated for consumer use, the granulated and packet products contain small amounts of carbohydrate (less than 1 gram per serving) that provide needed volume and texture. These are common food ingredients, which include maltodextrin and/or dextrose. Ingredients in all SPLENDA

®

No Calorie Sweetener products add so few calories per serving that all SPLENDA

®

No Calorie Sweetener Products meet the Food and Drug Administration's criteria for no-calorie foods (<5 calories/serving).

1. Eat only unprocessed foods (if available) and cook your own food (shoot for gluten free foods—like homemade baked potato fries, paleo almond bread, blah, blah, blah…
   

1. Count calories in order to know how to configure your back loads; (21) if you are coming in too flat your backloads are too low in carbs, if you’re coming in too soft and are holding bodywater you overdid your backload
   
   1. 
      
   2. Shoot for backloads of 10-20% maintenance level
      
   3. Keep fat levels very low in backloads
      
   4. Kiefer recommends to find your optimal backloading status by performing the initial phase of CBL, then recalibrate the CHO “requirements: I would do this for the cleanest bulk possible.
      
      
      
      

Start at half your carb needs (300/2 = 150g) on training days; 5 grams at night before beg on non-training days , high glcyemic.

Keep the non-training day load stable and up the post-training carbs every 2 weeks. So, two weeks at 150; if fat stable (or losing), 200 for two weeks; reassess and increase until BF holds stable. At this point, you will be building mass without fat.

Use the off days as "catch ups" from then on out. Some training sessions will require more carbs than others. The off days, catch up and do it right...blow it out. After about a month, you'll probably need to start doing these recalibrations. Oddly enough, when I start smoothing out is when I do a massive carb up on an OFF night."

1. Dairy products will slow results in some people; either cut them out or limit consumption of cheese, milk products, etc.
   

1. Evaluate current dietary scheme for hidden calories (ie. Nuts, cheese, eggs that could be including too many Pre-WO CHO or be insulinotropic)
   

1. DON’T fast longer than 14-20 hours and breakfast with protein : fat at usual ratio (1:1); this is to keep leptin levels high. Your overall levels of BF are regulated within the body by leptin and several other functions of the body (still a lot of research needs to be done here). The longer you remain in a fasted state at the lower levels of BF will cause leptin values to fall, thus slowing metabolism (ie. T3/T4 production) and inhibiting further lipolysis. In most cases trust your body, it will tell you when you need to feed—but be honest with the signals!
   
   
   1. 
      
      
      
      1. WORKOUT NUTRITION will have a lot of variability depending on when you workout, your volume, and whether your consuming carbs (CHO) peri, intra, or post. For this section we will focus on just the nutrition portion.
         
         
         1. 
            
            
            

Obviously, there's more to it than this, but this is 90% of the way there.

1. For high volume and/or lengthy workouts (>120min) plan your Backloads to accommodate higher CHO loads; while downgrading your Backloads for lighter workouts (ie. arms, shoulders, core, etc). Unsure of optimal ratios for this—requires further research.
   

1. Initiate shorter backloads (2 hour anabolic window) Kiefer states it is very difficult to store bodyfat in this post workout period due to tGLUT and muscle functions, providing your workout was enough intensity to stimulate a response.
   

1. If stalled out on CNS switch to CBL to enhance metabolism and gain muscle mass or back to CNS from CBL. Muscle mass increase amount of calorie burned/day (negligible amount) and all dependent upon goals at the time. Instead of Backloading have a Carb Nite every 4-5 days to replenish the body.⁴
   

This is done to decrease or inhibit fatty acid synthase (FAS), which downregulates after 3-4day window w/o eating CHOs. Within 4 hours the body upregulates FAS to beyond normal levels, so monitor Carb Nite if fat loss is ultimate goal.

1. Your carbohydrate types that you are consuming for your Backloads will help or hinder your progress. Unprocessed foods appear to work better, although high glycemic carbs are what we are trying to shoot for. Unprocessed, High glycemic > Processed, High glycemic.
   

1. Keep your overall level of sugar (ie. sucrose 50:50 ratio of fructose to glucose) with a 60g max total of fructose. Kiefer’s article “Lessons for Carb Back-Loading”, “To break the ketogenic cycle, we should use as pure of glucose as possible. For example, immediately post training (or the first meal that breaks the ketogenic part of the diet), we should ingest primarily glucose (not sucrose and not honey, as it’s possible that the disaccharides can be more lipogenic than fructose alone[35]). The body fails to convert glucose into fat at any appreciable rate but we should probably avoid ingesting it with fast-acting fats (like MCT) as this has some potential to increase triglyceride storage.” http://www.dangerouslyhardcore.com/1733/hi-tech-nutrient-conversion-lessons-for-carb-back-loading/ ¹⁵
   

Additionally, Naomi has commented on fructose loads here:

http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/forum/index.php?topic=523.msg4781#msg4781

1. “After the completion of training, stopping the proteolysis that occurs requires a large insulin spike: the larger, the better. Achieving a big spike takes high-glycemic, high-insulinemic carbs, which we can enhance by adding the right proteins and amino acids. “ See Chapter 18—16oz Carb Curls, Post Training in CBL. In order to achieve the desired effect you want from CBL and consume unprocessed foods, you have to find the high glycemic carbohydrate foods that will work with your body (ie. white rice, sweet potatoes, white potatoes, etc).
   

1. “Again, save the dirtiest treats—my favorites, like cherry turnovers—for the last meal because of the fat content wrapped up with the disaccharide sugar load. Although these may, theoretically, aid lipogenesis, the insulin load is worth the small amount that might be converted to fat or stored in fat cells.” Kiefer’s article again¹⁵.
   

*Incorporate a high glycemic carbohydrate and whey isolate before bed

1. Have a high glycemic carbohydrate before bed to spike insulin levels
   
2. If you’re on a ULC day have 1sc whey isolate + 1T coconut oil (optional) before bed
   
3. When your body weight becomes stalled the best case scenario is to just wait it out. Often times you will stall and continue losing fat if you keep on the same track, it just may take the body a while to accommodate you. Best case scenario, if you have two weeks, continue as normal, monitor and check. If you still are stalled evaluate progress.
   

One quick switch is too look at your overall level of protein: fats within the diet. If you’re not fueling your body enough, you will not lose weight. In a Podcast with Kiefer and Jim Laird (Round 2), “When your overall calories are too low, your metabolism shuts down systems that utilize too much energy. Your body becomes more efficient with the calories that it has and burns less overall calories. Intaking higher protein and fat intake will help keep the body running and allow it to become more inefficient at burning fat.” Comparison—inner city driving (inefficient burning of gas) versus highway driving (fuel economy)—you want to have the body burning up more fuel, so help it be more inefficient by giving it the right macros to accomplish the job, without the ability to store them.

1. From current interviews and article from Kiefer Low Glycemic meals will halt progress on CBL due to the length of time it takes for your insulin levels to drop at night; furthermore in relationship to the amount of dietary fat you have in your diet will also slow your progress. For those that are going extremely high on fat, this is for you:
   

“A quick back-of-the-envelope calculation, from the plan you included, puts your caloric load per day in excess of 6000 calories and probably around 7000. For example, one cup of oil is 2000 calories.

Now, your metabolic rate plus training is probably about half of that. Now, I know I emphasize that calories don't matter, but the fine print is that calories don't matter with swings of several hundred extra calories high or low on any given day--but you're overeating by several thousand. Your diet should be adequate to prevent just about anyone from losing weight. Also, note, that on ANY OTHER DIET, you would have gained weight.

And, seriously, a cup of oil? The last person I knew who tried that literally shit his pants driving home from work on day three. This was enough to convince him that drinking large amounts of oil might not be a good idea for digestion. It is, after all, a lubricant. Did you experience these problems at all, or anything unpleasant enough to indicate something might be wrong? The body has several ways of communicating when something is wrong. It's important to listen.

Cut the caloric load in half and sit back and wait. You'll halve calories simply by cutting the morning cream and the cups of oil. If hunger is a problem, mix in some fibrous vegetables.” Per Kiefer’s posting in the forums.

The diet will work, but if you’re overdoing it fat kid, yeah, you’re not going to make progress. If all the macros are in alignment you can get above the normal load for a while, but your body can’t process everything and will stall you out if you’re eating too much.

1. If you’re still stalled in a two week period with numerous tweeks it may be time to start from scratch. Increase vitamins that may deficient (ie. Calcium, vitamin D3, fish oil, ZMA (for sleep and recovery), GABA (sleep and hGH increase)
   

1. You can often judge the quality of your backloads by how you look in the AM period.
   
   
   1. If you’re still stalled on bodyfat loss, go on the DETOX DIET; link: http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/forum/index.php?topic=3586.0;topicseen (Thanks to Dmunnee!)
      
      
      TRAINING CHANGES
      As we should already know resistance training is key for CBL to work correctly; however, depending upon your goals and individual training styles you may have to make certain changes that will affect your overall level of performance on CBL. Now, Kiefer will have his own recommendations, but for those of us that want answers now I will put up the best information that I have collected on the forums and personal experience (if that accounts for much). As stated before this is a draft and is simply designed to consider different scenarios and solutions to optimizing your training to achieve your goals within the confines of CBL and CN principles.
      Length of Workouts
      1. High Volume training (>120min in duration) is going to affect your backloads and how you train. If you’re doing ultra marathon workouts, your results are going to be affected by your recovery. Are you sleeping enough? Are you getting enough carbs to sustain results?
         
      2. Moderate Volume (=60 min in duration) is about average and there shouldn’t be any problems incorporating any principles of CBL or CN for that matter. If you’re on CN though, you may have some trouble once you get into the lower tiers of bodyfat with energy and stamina. CN may have to get shifted a few days to accommodate faltering energy levels—or perhaps a simple CBL meal midway through the week.
         
      3. Low Volume/Circuit training (<60 min in duration) may not elicit a strong enough tGLUT response, unless the intensity is high.¹⁷ This may be a factor in some peoples training. (reference)
         
      4. Too little training—increase training days, switch training programs, change sets x reps
         
         
         1. 
            
            
            
      Time of Workout
      1. If you fall into the 4AM-11AM training block you may want to check out this link:
         

http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/forum/index.php?topic=2944.msg30222#msg30222

http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/forum/index.php?topic=2969.msg30648#msg30648

This should help you to figure out the right things to do in the AM Training process.

1. If you fall into the 11AM-2PM workout group, see: http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/forum/index.php?topic=3394.msg36736#msg36736
   
2. What are you whining about this is the sweetspot!
   
3. For shift workers and travelers this is going to get complicated—it depends (I’m stealing that from Kiefer, because a lot of this stuff depends). Here are some threads that may help you out:
   

http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/forum/index.php?topic=3458.msg37367#msg37367

http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/forum/index.php?topic=2571.msg39272#msg39272

http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/forum/index.php?topic=688.msg6289#msg6289

Type of Workouts

1. Strength training or powerlifting workout should have optimal effects on CBL. Powerlifters seem to love it, and still manage to make great progress in as far as fat loss goes. ¹⁸
   

1. Bodybuilders or hypertrophic type workouts seem to stimulate tGLUT optimally. Kiefer recommends repetitions in this range for optimal stimulation. Muscle contractions of 70-80% 1RM have large MPS responses, with a 1-4 hour stimulus window.^{16, 18}
   

1. Endurance workouts may encourage some response from tGLUT and MPS, but the affect may be limited by the type I muscle fibers and you may not get the full effect. Try enhancing workouts will some hypertrophy or strength sets x reps.^{16, 19, 20}
   

1. Mixed or hybrid styles I will refer you to the Rogue section of the DH forums. There’s some good info there to help you figure out your way. Experimental: I’ve been conducting Full Body workouts in order to stimulate the most GLUT4 response within the muscles (ie. Bodybuilding style glycogen depletion training) just to see if it has an effect versus traditional resistance training methods. ²⁰
   

CARDIO?

1. Endurance cardio, probably not going to be your best option. Kiefer’s article here explains why: http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/women-running-into-trouble/ For those of us that have no choice (ie. military) there are some ways to work around this. Kiefer proposes (from Podcast with Laird) that CN type dieting is more condusive to endurance running with small tweaks around the long run or competition periods.
   
   
   1. 
      
      
      
      1. Mixed training with HIIT (recommended at 2-3 x week) and long runs. Unsure as to full recommendation, but assuming from endurance runner recommendation from Kiefer that ULC days with endurance running would co-exist. Backloads would be performed after weight training days.
         

1. HIIT/Sprinter based training would be backloaded in accordance with Kiefer’s comments, same as a Powerlifting meet.
   
   
   1. 
      
      
      
      1. Doing light walking and just general movement type activities will only help with your fat loss. You just don’t want to get into the hamster wheel problems. Fasted walking in the morning is a great way to start your day and start up your metabolism. Conduct a short LISS walk in AM while fasting; add in an hour of LISS cardio on off days
         

1. Well there’s your problem! Seriously, just consider who has taught you certain exercises and ensure you’re using proper form and not going against common knowledge. Power cleans and snatches are not endurance exercises and should not be performed for reps. If you can’t do pull-ups without kipping, then work on your strength levels. Learn the correct way. Crossfit can be a useful tool, or it can become a nightmare. Think of your goals and incorporate useful training. Don’t follow the trendy workouts.
   

1. Overtraining is only going to be a problem for a few of us, as most people can’t quite get the full effect of training properly in the first place. However, if you’re on your way to 10%BF or lower and you train all the time then this is of utmost importance. This topic is quite controversial and is still a much studied topic in the sport science community. It tends to go back and forth between it’s very difficult to get into an overtrained status, unless you’re an endurance athlete; however, there are some things that you can watch out for symptom wise to monitor your progress. If you are not recovering from your workouts, your fat loss efforts will stop, as will your gains in the gym. There’s really no cookie cutter outline here for what to do, other than monitor your recovery and progress in the gym and body composition.^21,22,23,24 Things to look for:
   
   
   1. 
      
      
      

This may not be all the symptoms of overtraining, but it is really too generic a term to really be applied to such a large population. Basic, bare bolts theory, you’re doing too much and you can’t recover properly from your training. Without the additional ergogenic aids most people cannot sustain severe training regimes without proper rest and nutrition. If you’re abusing your body (guilty quite often) then it will come back to bite you. Monitor and if you need a break progress as follows—listen to your body it knows what you need if you’ll follow the signals.

1. Switch the volume and loading parameters in your workouts.
   
2. Not working—1 week full deload of all heavy, maximal loads. Start over from scratch.
   
3. Still no progress—1-2 weeks of full recovery.
   
4. After that I’d go to a doctor to get a full blood panel done and figure out what the hell is wrong with you.
   

FURTHER TROUBLESHOOTING

1. Metabolism changes –body temperature dropping in the morning; decreased morning heart rate; low blood levels of T3/T4¹⁴; stalling out on BF loss with calories below BMR.
   
   
   1. Sleep…are you getting it!^6,7,8
      
      1. Supplement with melatonin (3-6mg); zinc⁴;
         
      2. Sleep chambers dark enough, no distractions
         

[*]Too high level stress—go to the gym, don’t beat your spouse, don’t do drugs, don’t drink alcohol to solve your problems

[*]Take a Break, sometimes you just need a break in your diet to enhance your results and let your body reset (7-14 days).^11,12 This is if you have the time factor in your favor and not preparing for a bodybuilding show!

References:

¹ http://www.splendatruth.com/faq#18 (although release by the manufacturer—deemed important since they claim small amounts do add up as additional kcals)

² http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12079865 (Leptin signaling, adiposity, and energy balance.)

³ http://www.jacn.org/content/17/3/270.full Zinc May Regulate Serum Leptin Concentrations in Humans)

⁴http://www.marksdailyapple.com/leptin/#axzz23PB3mOpu (A good thread for Leptin regulation)

⁵http://www.eje-online.org/content/147/2/181.abstract?ijkey=8d2b43b34004a24e3440578fdc90bf65400271d2&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha (Fasting over 48 hours causes a fall in leptin (60%))

⁶http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC508375/pdf/1001882.pdf (Diurnal rhythms and varying shifts)

⁷http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?db=pubmed&cmd=historysearch&querykey=13 (Role of sleep and metabolism)

⁸http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18591489 (Sleep loss and obesity/diabetes associations)

⁹ http://physrev.physiology.org/content/79/2/451.full.pdf+html (Regulation of Body Weight in Humans)

¹⁰http://jap.physiology.org/content/99/6/2128.full (Effect of intermittent fasting and refeeding on insulin action in healthy men)

¹¹http://www.nature.com/oby/journal/v11/n2/full/oby200343a.html (Prescribed "Breaks" as a Means to Disrupt Weight Control Efforts)

¹²http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/the-full-diet-break.html (The Full Diet Break)

¹³ http://physrev.physiology.org/content/79/2/451.full.pdf+html (Regulation of Body Weight in Humans)

¹⁴http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC371281/pdf/jcinvest00683-0196.pdf (Dietary-induced Alterations in Thyroid Hormone Metabolism during Overnutrition)

¹⁵http://www.dangerouslyhardcore.com/1733/hi-tech-nutrient-conversion-lessons-for-carb-back-loading/ (Lessons for Carb Back-Loading, by Kiefer)

¹⁶Exercise training and protein metabolism: influences of contraction, protein synthesis, protein intake and sex-based differences. Nicholas, A. Burd, et al. J. Appl. Physio. May 2009.

¹⁷Effects of three distinct protocols of fitness training on body composition, strength, and blood lactate. Paoli A, et al. Mar, 2010. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20308971<p>¹⁸Muscular Adaptations in response to 3-different resistance training regimines: specificity of repetition maximum training zones. Campos, GE, et al. Eur. J. Appl. Physio., Nov, 2002. <a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=Muscular%20Adaptations%20in%20response%20to%203-different%20resistance%20training%20regemines%3A%20specificity%20of%20repetition%20maximum%20training%20zones.">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=Muscular%20Adaptations%20in%20response%2

Leptin will be primary target of increasing fat loss in this period^2,4,10
Lack of motivation to train
Lack of energy to train (do not confuse this with lethargy from switching dietary protocols)
Lack of increasing loads/intensity; strength declines; decreasing performance
Loss of appetite
Increase periods of lethargy or napping; also periods of insomnia at night
Decreased morning temperature (shows T3/T4 levels dropping thermogenesis)
You have to overstimulate (ie. Popping ephedra, caffeine, and aspirin like candy) just to train
Train sans CHO and then perform backloads later in the day as usual.
If preparing for an event (ie. track race) have backload with foods that you have tested prior to be easily handled on the stomach, night prior to racing event. Race fasted or ULC.
Training too much—HIIT may be a problem (limit to 2-3 x week) to avoid over training.
Suggest going on CN for majority of training, then prior to an event or long run having a backload two night prior to event.
Then having a full CN the night prior to the event. Run event like normal.
Walking and light cardio is not much of a problem, but anything over 65%MHR will decrease T3/T4 production by the thyroid. Need more research on how to stimulate this back into gear—other than rest and recovery period.¹⁴
Advanced athletes 5-6 days /week; 2-3 days/week
Intermediate athletes 3-4 days/week; HIIT 2-3 days/week
Beginners 2-3 days/week resistance training; HIIT 1-2 days/week
If you wakeup feeling bloated or holding onto excess subcutaneous water (ie. spillage) you may have to dial down the amount of CHO in the backload (ie. if you keep good records you should be able to find your own sweetspot—although this will also be linked to your workout and activity levels too).
If you wakeup and feel flat, your muscle are not full, and your skin is loose—you didn’t get enough CHO in your backload. Kiefer recommends that you go overboard once in a while just to see how it feels and you can backtrack your diet from there.
If you wakeup and your tight, no subcutaneous water you’re right where you want to be in CBL.
Late night workouts may require you to start CHO loading earlier, with a PB&J sandwich and a pre-WO shake. Determined by how you feel.
For long workouts in the usual time frame (ie. 3PM-6PM) >120 minutes, including some CHO from 30min in will decrease the cortisol response and also help activated MPS before you’re done with your workout.
For optimal mass gains, consume at least 20g high glycemic CHO post-WO within the usual parameters (ie. 5g leucine, 20g whey isolate, 20g dextrose, 5 Creatine, caffeine).
For lower BF trainees, include intra-WO CHO with whey isolate to stave of MPB and increase MPS a longer overall time period, or for extremely heavy, lengthy workouts (>120min) Mentioned in the DH podcast with Kiefer and John Meadows, who is the pinnacle of high volume training.
Biojacked Podcast—Kiefer and John Meadows: The general formula: ULC until training (I wouldn't even worry about vegetables, but would supplement heavily with coconut oil and make beef your main source of protein); With training, consume 200-250 grams of pure carbs with hydrolysates mixed in during and post training. If you choose during, wait 15 to 30 minutes into the training to do so.
14-18 for 10-8%BF ^{(still under review)}
12-14 hours under 6-8%BF^{5, 10}

[Heimdallr 1643]

Hab ich das jetzt richtig verstanden, beim Density Bulking wird auch an Off-Tagen geladen? das heißt genauso verfahren wie an einem Trainingstag bis auf die Pre- bzw Post- Mahlzeiten?

Mit wie viel Gewichtssteigerung im Monat kann ich rechnen, wie groß sollte der kcal Überschuss ausfallen?

Ich würde mit fortgeschrittenen Kraftwerten anfangen, Körpergewicht liegt bei 79kg auf 183cm.

[VikingHorse 0]

Gewichtssteigerung kann keiner sagen, aber wie immer gilt: gesunden Menschenverstand walten lassen. +1kg ist wohl noch im Rahmen - 3 kg wäre wohl viel zu viel. Am besten cyclest du die Kalorien.

[Heimdallr 1643]

Und wie sollen die Carbs am NTT gegessen werden?

[Alc 1164]

abends ... high gi.